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Hetty Green and the timeless appeal of market timing

Hetty Green and the timeless appeal of market timing post image

I have long had a crush on Hetty Green. Not a romantic one: Green lived a century ago, and not even my imagination is that deluded.

Rather the type of infatuation that kids have for their favourite Harry Potter character or that billionaire tech bros have for Ayn Rand.

Kind of fun to think about, but a fantasy. Like a Patronus charm, or a government that moves fast and breaks things – regulations, democracies, good taste – without causing lots of collateral damage.

Hetty Green: Proto degenerate trader (Image: Wikipedia)

With Hetty Green the impossible dream on offer is the mastery of market timing. Of selling your assets when euphoria is at a peak, and then buying back cheap when others are in despair.

It sounds so easy on paper.

Buy low sell high!

And two-way market timing is steroids to your hypothetical returns on a spreadsheet too.

But in practice most people who try market timing might as well be waving a wand over a toad.

The gilded age of market timing

Hetty Green though was the first lady of market timing.

Quite literally.

Because if you’ve heard of Hetty Green (1834-1916) then you’ll also know what the papers called her:

The Witch of Wall Street.

Which honestly isn’t doing my crush any harm.

I mean, while it’s certainly sexist – hailing from a time when any woman making decisions on Wall Street seemed a phantasm – the Witch of Wall Street epithet is also kind of, well, wicked.

But the bigger point is that any female investors were rare back then. So one looming so large in the public’s imagination in the age of Robber Barons was unprecedented.

Be still my beating heart!

Fortunately my goth (/emo) phase pre-dated my investing, so I didn’t know as I mainlined The Cure anything about widow Henrietta’s all-black garb and her sombre hats festooned in black ostrich feathers.

And I certainly wouldn’t have understood how original her contrarian thinking was.

I’ll have what he’s not having

You see Green’s mystique wasn’t simply down to a wardrobe Robert Smith or Billie Eilish would die for.

It was also thanks to how ‘the richest woman in America’ got that way.

Which – supposedly – was by appearing in Wall Street in the midst of market crashes like some gusseted Grim Reaper, hoovering up stock certificates from desperate and over-extended speculators, and then floating back out of town to return to her lair to wait for the next bear market.

A deeper reading of her life shows this to be nonsense – Green kept a permanent desk at a New York bank from where she conducted her extended financial affairs –  but the image still packs a punch.

And the gist of it is true.

Many decades before Warren Buffett was being greedy when others were fearful, Green reportedly said:

“There is no great secret in fortune making. All you do is buy cheap and sell dear, act with thrift and shrewdness, and be persistent”.

And the historical records agree that Green did regularly buy when there was blood on the streets, to quote Nathan Rothschild, another battlefield-raven of an investor.

Magical thinking and market timing

For example Hetty scored a big early win by loading up on ‘greenbacks’ – a novel form of US government debt created by Abraham Lincoln to fund the Civil War effort.

When other investors dumped the paper for gold, Green was a buyer at 40-50 cents on the dollar. She profited mightily when it became clear that the US government would stand behind its obligations.

Her life story is full of such counter-cyclical trading.

But what is less understood about Green – and which I’ll touch on below – is that this legendary market timer actually rarely sold.

Green certainly bought when other investors were on their uppers. But she bought-to-hold.

And here we have a key insight into market timing, and how not to do it.

In, out, shaken all about

Because one of the massive problems with market timing, at least if understood as trying to get out at a top – or even when you fear you’re only halfway to the bottom – is someday you must get back in again.

And evidence and common sense suggests that while you might be skilled or lucky once, to expect to beat the market twice in a row with great timing smacks of hubris.

But buying cheap in a crash and then tucking it away?

While not short of its own problems – such as lousy returns on the cash set aside while you wait for a crash, perhaps for years – such a strategy is at least closer to investing than trading.

Which, again, is not to say you’ll do better than a passive investor who just pound-cost averages in more money regardless.

Indeed in a superb post for the ages, blogger Nick Maggiulli once showed how even God – presumed here to be a perfect market-timer – would usually fail to beat an investor who simply socks away more money on a schedule.

How come?

Well, waiting for a buyable dip as the market races upwards has an opportunity cost. Your cash usually isn’t compounding at anything like the same rate of return as shares.

Worse, any crash that eventually does come often won’t make up the difference – assuming you even have perfect knowledge of the best moment to buy such a dip.

Which – spoiler alert – you don’t.

Against that, the Dow Jones Industrial Average was in the low 100s in 1916, the year Hetty Green died.

It touched 45,000 in December 2024.

Which is to say the US stock market at least has always eventually recovered – and thus has always eventually bailed out a buy-and-hold investor.

Avoiding crashes with your market timing efforts might feel good in the moment. But missing out on big long-term gains will kill you.

Mistiming en masse

I won’t say there’s nobody taking their whole portfolios in and out of equities on a rinse-and-repeat path to riches.

But if there is then they are hiding their talents – and the resultant fortunes – under many bushels.

Certainly there’s not many. I can’t recall ever reading research suggesting market timing delivered any excess returns for so-called retail investors write large. (That’s commoners like you and me).

On the contrary, Googling reveals plenty of research suggesting bad timing costs us dearly.

Investing even has special phrases like the ‘behaviour gap’ to flag how private investors make return-sapping decisions by trying to time when they invest their money where.

You can’t even pay a professional to do it

But yes, some small number of individuals may have the gift of market timing.

As I said above, you’ll soon find out if that’s you if you try.

Enjoy your imminent riches!

Indeed you might think anyone so blessed would quickly become a professional investor in order to truly profit from their rare skill.

Alas – evidence of wonderful market timing by professional investors is notably absent, too.

As a group, most go-anywhere hedge funds have chalked up mediocre returns for years. Their managers blamed everything from irrational markets to low rates to index fund distortions for their woes. But if they really could market time then they’d have stayed 100% in US large cap stocks, feasting on the gains.

More likely they long ago judged such companies had become too popular and paid the price.

Another case in point are tactical-allocation funds. Their whole raison d’être is to judiciously get in and out of different asset classes at the right time.

But Morningstar recently reported that:

When compared against the average fund in the moderate-allocation category, tactical asset-allocation funds have lagged by more than 2 percentage points per year, on average, over the past five years.

They’ve trailed by roughly twice that amount when compared against a simple portfolio composed of 60% stocks and 40% bonds and rebalanced annually.

These funds are very well-resourced outfits where pay and bonuses depend on getting such calls right. Yet they can’t do it well enough to beat a 60/40 portfolio.

So do you feel lucky, punter?

I read this week the chairman of Ruffer – a multi-asset allocation fund – trying to spin poor performance of late as some sort of rallying cry.

To paraphrase: equity markets are too high, and we know because we got out two years ago and since then we’ve lagged badly and this always happens to us.

Um guys… that’s not a feature, it’s a bug.

Tips for would-be market timers

I like Ruffer by the way, and I read their reports because I like to hear what they have to say.

But the point is market timing is much, much harder than it looks.

My best market timing advice to readers would be don’t do it. Our house guidance is to invest passively into index funds and ignore the noise for good reason.

Both evidence and observation suggests to me most people will do worse in trying to strategically juggle their asset allocations around, whether they’re doing it by maths, intuition, or chicken entrails.

Market timing can also be a gateway to other bad behaviours. Stuff like over-trading, or focusing on short-term wins versus the long-term gains that really drive returns.

All that said, Monevator is a broad church and I’m a naughty active investor myself who absolutely does shift my allocation around depending on my mood swings reading of the economy and the markets.

And while I have many faults, I’m not too much of a hypocrite.

What’s more there are clearly some successful funds – and a few legendary investors – who do employ timing to some degree.

Famed US fund manager Stanley Druckenmiller hasn’t had a single down year in decades. He obviously didn’t achieve that by sitting on his hands and reading Jack Bogle.

So if someone wants to try market timing, why not?

Again, a hugely attractive trait of investing is that it is scored.

Provided you’re keeping meticulous records, the markets will soon let you know if your timing experiments are costing you (very likely) or adding value (at least until they don’t…).

Ideally run the experiment when you’re young and any painful lessons won’t do much damage – and while there’s still time for a lucrative career switch to The City should you discover you do have edge.

I did it my way

Here’s a few personal hints about market timing from my decades as a wannabe Hetty Green:

Have a plan in advance. Suddenly shifting from passive investing to becoming a market timer in the midst of a crash isn’t being strategic. It’s panicking.

Don’t go all-in or all-out of equities. Some market strategies advocate for it. I say be humble. Warren Buffett is a legend for letting his cash pile-up when markets are richly-valued. But Buffett doesn’t sell all his shares. And neither you or I are Warren Buffett.

Focus on the egregious anomalies. The CAPE ratio is 20% above its long-run average? Who cares. It could stay that way for a decade – or forever. But Japan in the 1980s, Dotcom stocks in 1999, or – whisper it – inflation-linked bonds in the near-zero interest rate era? Crazy. You could have at least halved your stake and been soberly prudent in doing so.

Always remember you have to get back in. Don’t wait for a perfect checklist of signals that the bear market has bottomed. You should be buying long before that. I’m always legging in and out of positions when I’m (for my sins) trying to curb the worst damage of a falling market. It’s almost a strategy of rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic – saving a percentage point here and there. Sounds crap, until you recall that on the Titanic there weren’t enough lifeboats, and the markets are hardly any kinder.

Watch momentum. I’m not a trend follower, but there is evidence that big breaks in momentum can signal turning points in market direction. Obviously it’s not easy or everyone would be doing it, but you should at least read up on the basics about 200-day moving averages and the like if you’re dabbling.

Clinging to quality versus the dash for trash. I did a bit of useful reshuffling during the Global Financial Crisis. I sold my bank holdings early, and kept buying other equities as the market fell and bottomed out. But when the rally came, my portfolio was initially left behind. Why? Because I’d loaded up on safer higher-quality stocks. Yet what recovers first in a new bull market is often whatever junky stocks didn’t go bust in the downturn but were priced like they would. Once more with feeling: this game is not easy!

I could continue but my co-blogger The Accumulator will put out a contract out on me. So that’s enough off-messaging for one day.

Market timing: unnecessary and insufficient

Of course in a long career every professional will get market timing calls right now and then.

If they’re able to then get lots of publicity for it, doing so might make their name as a market sage for life. The financial media isn’t known for rigorous accounting or counterfactual thinking.

But we’re about taking charge of our futures here on Monevator, and this is your own money at stake.

Your financial freedom, your early retirement, or your kids’ future.

And guess what? You don’t need to make a name for yourself as the person who called a crash right once and then filled their funds with client money for years on the back of it.

Rather, you need decent returns compounded over multiple decades to reach your financial goals.

Market timing mayhem is more likely to be a pitfall than a boost on such a journey.

To give one example: selling out in a bear market and then failing to buy back in before the market redoubles will permanently impair your portfolio – or even worse your appetite for any investment at all.

The most damaged traders are the once-burned market timers who subsequently sit in cash forever.

It’s not easy being Green

Again: most people will do best with a sensible financial plan that doesn’t rely on luck or genius.

Read our passive investing guide and have at it.

But if you must try market timing, I’d aim to be more like Hetty Green and less like your favourite social media huckster or YouTube trading guru.

Look to be an active buyer of risk assets when markets are down, say, but aim to then hold indefinitely.

Shift towards value or momentum at the margin. But don’t move in and out of markets wholesale.

And get some funereal black for your wardrobe.

Because even with this more modest approach to market timing there’s a strong chance you’re going to need it.

{ 18 comments… add one }
  • 1 xxd09 March 14, 2025, 10:08 am

    The only successful market timing I have come across is by already wealthy financial knowledgable investors who have the free money to buy on stockmarket dips
    For the rest of of us just buying the total market through an index fund and leaving it well alone to compound is the winning investment policy
    Investors should then concentrate their efforts on items under their direct control ie save as much as you can,keep costs as low as you can and live as frugally as you can
    Not nearly as an exciting investment policy as trading/market timing (gambling?) but does require strength of character and fortitude/discipline to make it work
    xxd09

  • 2 Paraquat March 14, 2025, 10:18 am

    Absolutely agree with @xxd09 on the overall strategy and the luxury of holding and buying the dip only being available to the already wealthy (not me!). But in all honesty, with 10 years to go until I need to drawdown, I’ve pulled my equity index trackers and parked them in the Money Markets until this correction bottoms out. I know it’s market timing, but I can’t afford a 30-40% cratering and a long recovery at this stage in my plans. Besides, the stress was too distracting from my daily life. I know people will say “it isn’t different”, but this time geopolitically, I’d say things are very different. Trump is upending all known norms and showing no intention of about-turning (as he did in his first term). Coupled with the rest of the world’s determination to go hard on the tariff wars and the actual live wars that show no end, I can’t help but feel we’re on the precipice of a major crash and a lost decade of recovery. Either way, I’m happy to watch from the sidelines for now and I’m quite certain I’m not alone.

  • 3 Vroom March 14, 2025, 11:12 am

    Seconding @Paraquat, as a self-confessed ‘market timer’. Fully aware it’s net cost me since the credit crunch, even accounting for Covid (well timed getting out, too slow getting back in, as usual). But it’s been a smoother and safer ride, which helps me run more risk when there’s a ‘following wind’ (helpful macro, helpful CB’s, 50d > 200d etc). & less risk at times like now (despite the technicals screaming ‘oversold, even dead cats bounce’).

    Maggiuli etc write well on staying invested, but they’re representing an industry that’s heavily incentivised to making that argument (staying invested = AUM = bonuses all round) and they’re writing from a ‘winning’ country over a timeline that we know with hindsight was a ‘winning period’. It would be interesting to see their take on investing in Greece from 1990 (huge losses), or for that matter Argentina, Russia or even Italy. Does Maggiuli think it makes sense to ‘always stay invested’ in a basket case, without hindsight bias?

    To me, you have at least to ask where the US is now? Is Trump seriously trying to dismantle the world order that has made the US stock market ‘always win’? What happens next? What’s the worst case for a heavily overvalued stockmarket of a great power over a generational timeline? e.g. when the p/e’s on Nikkei got silly in the late 1980s, it subsequently fell 75% over 20 years. Would Maggiuli have you ‘always invested’ through that too?

    I don’t know the answers, but I don’t think we *have* to be afraid of the questions?

    What I’d really love to know is what Druckenmiller’s running right now, given both his brilliance at never having a down year and his connections to Bessent etc…

  • 4 Fremantle March 14, 2025, 11:22 am

    That well trodden path to investing success, be born into a rich family, get an education in money management, inherit a fortune, follow sound investment strategy, be lucky.

    I’m being a little trite, because there are some nuggets in her story, including women maintaining financial independence, frugality, long term investing.

    Interesting times she was investing in.

  • 5 tetromino March 14, 2025, 12:53 pm

    Thanks TI, the idea of ‘buying at the right price then holding’ is helpful framing. It also reminds me of the neat Collaborative Fund paper about bubbles: ‘The Reasonable Formation of Unreasonable Things’. If we don’t ask ourselves whether we’re happy with the price we have to pay, it seems to me we are exposing ourselves to the popping of bubbles.

  • 6 Maggie March 14, 2025, 3:22 pm

    I have not choose timing for some time now – stick to a passive index fund.

    Could you say something if anything about what investor do with Trump uncertainty. My fund value dropped quite significantly over the past months also. Is a recession coming.

    Thank you.

  • 7 Rob March 14, 2025, 9:18 pm

    I do active and passive investing but don’t like market timing – because it is very tricky and possibly impossible. To me you are best off having a general idea of what you are buying and avoiding doing anything stupid or that feels a bit off. Eg bonds < 2% isn’t likely to work while 5% sounds a lot better, if stocks have a massive PE based upon hopes and dreams that possibly isn’t going to work. If something pays a good return right now and has no obvious red flags it’s probably okay. If you don’t understand it you probably shouldn’t buy it. General rule seems to be finding something boring paying a reliable yield and a good sign of success seems to not having to make too many decisions or get too worried. And not getting worried is easier if you know you are getting a good yield which fortunately is easier these days. The main challenge is ignoring hype while everyone else makes tons of money when you believe you shouldn’t participate as it can get tempting to bend a little. At least how it seems to me.

  • 8 Warren March 15, 2025, 7:31 am

    Always good to be reminded of these points. You have to remember that all the fears people have about over valuation, mag7 concentration, geopolitical uncertainty, deepseek, tariffs and soon are already in the current pricing. The recent correction has served as a reminder that markets don’t always go up, so quite healthy really and no need to fret. Greed and fear can compel us to sell st these times but it would not be based on an edge, just a gut feeling. It’s normally better to stay invested.

  • 9 JPGR March 15, 2025, 8:36 am

    We don’t know whether things are different this time or not. All we can say is Trump is currently attacking the post-WWII order. He may change his mind tomorrow, in a week, in a month, in a year, never. MAGA may or may not survive a Trump presidency. We neither can know nor control these events. Nor can we know now how best to react to this uncertainty. Logically I think it’s best to ignore, at least from an investing perspective.

  • 10 Marco March 15, 2025, 9:02 am

    I do understand the psychology of people panicking and dumping stock now. The internet is full of people saying they are making a rational rather than emotional decision because of Trump.

    Although I empathise with others, to react so emotionally goes against my investing strategy. I would feel a strong sense of disgust if I made any big moves based on the noise.

    Therefore, as per my unwritten IPS, I am staying the course. On April 6th all family ISAs and JISAs are being topped up and straight into global equities.

    I do keep about 10% of liquid networth in cash outside of tax sheltered accounts. Having a non earning spouse means no tax on cash interest up to 18500 pounds, and with current interest rates that’s not a bad net rate of return.

  • 11 Prospector March 15, 2025, 10:34 am

    Timely piece, TI with the S&P hitting correction territory last week.

    It’s like a Siren call trying to time the market. I think part of the appeal is not just thinking that you can beat the market. Speaking to a lot of people who have tried timing the market a big part of their motivation is risk. They want to avoid seeing £££s wiped off their portfolio’s value. Though I haven’t crunched the numbers I suspect there is cognitive dissonance at play. While you might well end up with lower annual risk adjusted returns by timing the market , I’d question whether that’s really the measure of risk you should be using when long term investing.

    And even using annual risk adjusted return a portfolio with a constant proportion of equities that’s stays invested with an equity content equal to the average equity exposure while being “in/out” during the period trying to time the market is likely to outperform.

    But the Siren’s call is strong and has lured me on more than one occasion. Having seen the equity market on a tear in 94 and 95 I decided to sit on cash watching the market go up and up. It wasn’t until the the dot-com bubble burst /post 9-11 crash that I got back in. And while I invested close to the bottom in 2002 (in a tracker – trendsetting for the time) of course the market didn’t fall as far as it I’d invested from 94 in the first place. I learnt two valuable lessons from this experience
    1) what Nick Maggiulli excellent article shows with data
    2) You have to be incredibly patient – yes I had a sense markets were overvalued and a correction/crash coming but it took another 3 years while I was sitting in cash and those around me were saying if you had invested £5000 in Psion you’d be a millionaire by now.

    But this experience helped me resist the Siren call until late 2016 , when I was convinced US tech was overvalued. So I ditched the trackers in the SIPP and sat on cash. This time my experience in 94 kept eating at me and I wasn’t able to stay patient. Probably a good thing as I bought back in mid 2017. Even though there was a modest self-off towards the end of 2018 the market didn’t fall back to the point I bought in at. And a costly mistake as the market went up in the 6 months I was sitting in the sidelines.

    And most recently having decided 90% equity allocation was too racy. This time the Sirens called to me that I could time the shifts in my allocation. GenAI has put too much concentration in too few US tech stocks in my trackers I thought. So switched in April 2024. Thankfully learned something from previous experiences and and didn’t do an all or nothing job this time. And even though there has been a correction since, guess what the S&P (as of date of writing , who knows what next week brings) is still up compared to the level I got out at.

    So future shifts in asset allocation better done by gradual amount each month methinks.

  • 12 Delta Hedge March 15, 2025, 10:39 am

    Superb writing as always @TI. Very topical. “Market timing” is ‘fuzzy’:
    *Is it trying to predict big market crashes?
    * Is is trying to catch short-term swings: buying stocks for a few days or weeks, hoping they’ll go up quickly?
    * Is it using complex formulas and charts: to try and find patterns in the market?
    * Or is it just trying to buy when stocks are “cheap” and sell when they’re “expensive”?: but what is “cheap” and “expensive”? Very much up for debate.
    Because there’s many different ways to “time the market,” it’s hard to say whether it “works” in some sense or not. Some people might get lucky with one method, but it might not work for someone else using a different method, or even the same one in different circumstances. If everyone has a different idea of what “market timing” is, it’s also hard to know what to test. And, even if everyone could agree on what it is (spoiler, they can’t), then it’s still so easy to be fooled. If someone has good results once or twice, it might (or might not) just be chance. With a small number of data points, and a lack of a clear definition, it’s unfalisiable. Not even wrong. Maybe it can work, sometimes (or not). But, if so, then is it reliably repeatable? And how could you even tell? The market is dynamical. You can never step in the same river twice, as the ancient Greeks said – and they knew a thing or two 😉

    My sense, FWIW, is that each to their own here, but, if market timing is a sin against the passive canon, then, if one has to sin, then sin just a little. Like you say: wait for the extremes of valuations (high/low); the vertiginous price moves (up/down); use just part, not all your portfolio; use it rarely, not often. To which I’d just add that narrative follows price, not the other way round. So, by the time you’ve read it, it’s already too late to act upon it (normally). If anything, it’s a counter signal, like the shoe shine boy’s stock tips or (in my case) hearing random commuters in the winter of 2017 talking, with the ersatz confidence of newly acquired ‘authority’, about ‘distributed ledgers’. If you must panic, then do so before stocks begin falling, not during or after. Likewise, the time to buy is after and in the aftermath of the crash, not in its midst, whilst you’re calmer, but still in ‘pain’ and worrying about your job, your retirement, your future. You have to do the opposite of the natural emotional response. As Lawrence of Arabia says when snuffing out matches with his finger, “The trick, William Potter, is not minding that it hurts”. Easier said than done, but the financial markets reward discipline over smartness, and it’s easier to become disciplined than it is to be smart.

  • 13 The Investor March 15, 2025, 10:52 am

    Good thoughts all, thanks — on the passive investing meets market timing front, here’s a take from @TA for members last year that’s obviously worth a read by those who can:

    We should always be prepared to adapt our principles. But not to abandon them.

    In the case of passive investing in an uncertain world, I believe that means following the rules most of the time… but also keeping your eyes open for major market changes that merit a cautious countermove in response.

    https://monevator.com/passive-investor-market-timing/

  • 14 Hariseldon March 15, 2025, 11:14 am

    Recent experience might be a poor guide to the future……

    We’ve had a very good run since 2009 with a brief intermission in 2020, there’s a lot of good news priced in.

    There’s a lot of things that have had a poor return of recent years and a rotation to the underperforming is not impossible.

  • 15 Dan March 15, 2025, 4:49 pm

    I’m not so sure if it is classed as market timing per se however I did decide to reduce exposure to global trackers before the recent downturn began. I’ve been increasingly uncomfortable with the level of US exposure they were bringing me and specifically to the so called magnificent 7. Investing is best carried out dispassionately however I just don’t feel comfortable buying into companies that are actively supporting the Tangerine Tyrant and his sycophants. I also believe these companies are actively making the world a worse place, on purpose, in the pursuit of money. I just don’t care about building wealth enough to ignore the morally repugnant actions of certain people/parties/companies. I know my actions make naff all difference to anything and may even harm my future wealth, but I just can’t bring myself to care. Passive investing in global trackers just feels like a tawdry affair to me at the moment.

  • 16 Delta Hedge April 5, 2025, 9:28 am

    Your circumstances and risk preferences may differ, but if, like me, you’re nearly fully allocated to equities with your tax wrapper allocations but still have substantial excess cash held (due to ISA/SIPP contribution limits) in bank act’s and Premium Bonds, then maybe now is a good time to get that ‘dry powder’ ready by moving the cash ‘on platform’ into very short duration (to avoid interest rate duration risk) low coupon (to reduce IT hit to returns) gilts in the GIA and to be ready to sell them and immediately use proceeds to buy equities if this market drop gets really sever, i.e. over 50% futher down or say below 3,000 on the S&P 500.

    Pockets of ‘cheapness’ are arguably already emerging. Nvidia is now on a TTM P/E of 32 and NTM of 20 now. TTM EPS was 147% and NTM estimated at 62%. That’s a PEG of 0.22 or 0.32 (past/future growth).

    If markets in the US go down another 40% from here to ~3,000 on S&P 500 then personally I can’t see the worst affected names in big tech growth falling less than 50% more from here and perhaps much (much) more than that for ‘bubble’ valuations like Tesla and Palantir (disclosure I have a small holding in latter and am still way up even after the current ~40% pullback from the ATH in February), the latter of which for example still trades at, (a seemingly absurd valuation on past earnings/sales) of around 350x for trailing P/E and still over 60x for trailing P/S). In 2022 in fell nearly 85% in total before 20 bagging to the ATH less than a couple of months ago.

    There could be some bargains coming up if things really cut up rough now.

    If you’re planning to buy if this were to happen (and DYOR and make your own mind up on this) then consider having your cash actually ready to hand to rapidly deploy.

  • 17 Delta Hedge April 5, 2025, 10:24 am

    [NB: should be “it fell” not “in fell” above. Apologies]

    Meb of Cambrian quoting the great PTJ “nothing good happens below the 200 DMA”:

    https://www.youtube.com/live/QK1r6irjCxo

    Very true. Also, re: my earlier comment, if you’re doubling down into single names, then your stock selection better be good because, also quoting PTJ, losers average losers.

  • 18 Delta Hedge April 5, 2025, 10:58 am

    OTOH (chart & table #5 in link below) when VIX crosses 45 since 1998 82% positive 12 month returns, with mean and median +17.3% and +23.9%:

    https://www.dailychartbook.com/p/dc-lite-336-9355c5f670ef3d9a

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